Urban Development and Proposals Discussion

[trtcttc]

Which other provinces have two major cities of roughly equal size, though?

And we have two large stadiums and soon to be two premier NHL arenas. But as a province we are only close to the same size as BC, and there just isn't the money to go around for funding two of each thing. Especially one that has pretty limited uses.

The only other province with 2 or more CFL teams is Ontario, and all 3 of them have recently built or recently renovated stadiums. Or... do the Argos still play at Sky Dome or is it BMO Stadium?? Cause BMO was recently renovated, I don't think Sky Dome has.

The GTA has more population than the whole of Alberta, and Toronto has TFC which also uses the stadium. Argos do still play at BMO Field, which is being temporarily expanded for the World Cup and is worse than almost every stadium in the US. The economics just doesn't really work without the NFL or in Europe's case, Association Football.

 

[darwink]

The city could even leverage the cost of the stadium against the district redevelopment to cover a good portion of the cost.

The city doesn't own the land or the Stadium. To save money in the 80s the city swapped the land with the university during the expansion of the LRT and Crowchild.

 

[thecivilengineer]

As UofC own the stadium and i think they are not willing to do anything on it. Definitely need a new stadium, soccer is also getting popular can be used for that too. I have been to some of Cavalry fc game and they have decent crowd even though the ground is on temporary stand and capacity is 5000

 

[CalgaryTiger]

Calgary's miss was not building a new stadium for the '88 games. If a better stadium was built then, versus one from 60's, we would have something to renovate (BC Place, SkyDome).

We have beat this to death but the move is doing something with the Grand Stand. You get Stampeder's games, the Stampede, put a bubble on it in the winter and right next to whatever Lindsay Park is called now you have a climate controlled field.

 

[darwink]

i think they are not willing to do anything on it.

If someone else is paying they are happy to own a better asset. Many years until University District and University Quarter are built out though. Plus the city has to decide what they are going to do with Crowchild.

 

[UrbanWarrior]

Calgary's miss was not building a new stadium for the '88 games. If a better stadium was built than, versus one from 60's, we would have something to renovate (BC Place, SkyDome).

We have beat this to death but the move is doing something with the Grand Stand. You get Stampeder's games, the Stampede, put a bubble on it in the winter and right next to whatever Lindsay Park is called now you have a climate controlled field.

I am very down for GMC stadium becoming a full multi-use stadium. More than enough space to do it on.

 

[Albertasaurus]

At some point, I wonder if structural issues might force a debate about McMahon's future? I wonder if a new or massively renovated stadium at the centre of a high density redevelopment similar to what was done in Ottawa might be the way forward?

 

[konradiical]

I mean Calgary can build something like Winnipeg or Hamilton have. It is new, smaller but very nice and probably doesn't cost too much. I have been to both a they are great! Stampeders and Cavalry can play in it. I'm sure some other teams can use it and maybe outdoor concerts as well?

We dont need no bilion dollar stadium, but for a city our size we need something modern even if it is smaller. In a perfect world using the Stampede Stadium would be the best idea but Im sure they could find a place central in the city near the arena that could fit a smaller modern stadium somewhere.

 

[Albertasaurus]

I would think a decent CFL-ready facility should be relatively affordable - this isn't the NFL. Capacity of 30,000 would be fine. Winnipeg, Hamilton and Regina all built new stadia, and all are cities half or less the size of Calgary.

 

[Nawads]

I would think a decent CFL-ready facility should be relatively affordable - this isn't the NFL. Capacity of 30,000 would be fine. Winnipeg, Hamilton and Regina all built new stadia, and all are cities half or less the size of Calgary.

Depends what we call affordable. I doubt we could get a 30,000 seat stadium for less then $200 million. If we spend that much or more it needs to get used for more then just the Stamperders CFL games.

Tim hortons field is pretty basic, and cost $150 million to build ten years ago.

 

[GoVertical]

Probably means that the market has finally bottomed out and properties have marked down to market clearing prices. This is a good sign!

BVS is not well suited to conversion, other than having small floor plates.

Plus it's also got one of the busiest (and most leased) food courts in downtown. The lunch hour is insane!

 

[darwink]

I would think a decent CFL-ready facility should be relatively affordable - this isn't the NFL. Capacity of 30,000 would be fine. Winnipeg, Hamilton and Regina all built new stadia, and all are cities half or less the size of Calgary.

The issue is finding the $300 million or so, likely closer to $500 these days. Which sure, a bargain, given that BC Place by the time of the World Cup will have had a billion dollars worth of renovations over 15 years. They had a somewhat compelling business case though: the old roof and lack of air conditioning made the stadium very hot from May through September, and reduced potential trade show events, which even prior to the renovation accounted for the majority of revenue.

 

[Surrealplaces]

I'll probably take some flack for this, but I'm not sure it makes sense to build a new stadium these days. Even to build a nice compact stadium like they have in Winnipeg or Ottawa would likely cost upwards of $500 million, and to do a retrofit type reno like Hamilton would be probably something upward of $250 million. The retrofit might make sense, but $500 million for a venue that gets used 8-10 times a year is a an awful lot.

Not that I wouldn't love to to have something like the Winnipeg or Ottawa stadium, but it's a steep ask given the attendance and the amount of days of use season. I'd like to see a smaller ~20-25,000 seat stadium built in a more central location that could host both the Stamps and the Cavalry.

 

[CalgaryTiger]

Hamilton was not a reno, it was a new build, the stadium turned 90 degrees from the previous stadium. Ottawa is actually about redo half of theirs.

Calgary's will need to be a 100% public project, with the owner's portion be paid by a lease. I see very little appetite for that from the public in the next 5 years, let alone 10. Especially since it is a UofC facility (provincial). I think the McMahon stadium society do what needs to be done to keep the lights on at McMahon until, like somone said, there will be a conversation about McMahon like there was with the dome. It will either need a lot of money to be fixed (it is reinforced concrete) or a new stadium will be needed.

We're 10 years-ish from that point. Stampeder's attendance likely wanes in that time too because of the stadium and general disinterest in the CFL.

It is funny we got the Grey Cup bidding against Edmonton who does have a better stadium... lol. Goes to show you, so little of this is about the game.

 

[lemongrab]

Stampede Grandstand is by far the best option

Stamps are drawing 18-25k for everything except a few more for the Labour Day game, and there is every reason to expect future decline is more likely than growth.

You'd barely have to set the new grandstand any further back than the current infield buildings. And it would be easy to design it to preserve the main horse slaughter event if you really want to.