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Urban Development and Proposals Discussion

The challenge with the Co-op Brentwood proposal wasn't simply the height of the tower. The fact it put the ass end of a grocery store where the ARP's high street was supposed to continue west didn't help, nor did the fact it maintained a substantial amount of surface parking, ensuring driving to the local retail was made as easy as possible. The residents of Brentwood had legitimate concerns with the design as it was proposed, beyond just the height that exceeded the ARP limits.
 
Wow not sure what kind of wizardry they pulled but funding for four capital projects approved by council:

  • Arena
  • BMO Centre
  • Arts Commons (Phase 1)
  • Field house
 
The grocery store blocking the streetway through to Brentwood Mall was my biggest gripe. It would be an absolute fail if they do that. Brentwood could be a great template for a TOD and having the streetway carry through could make for a nice mini highstreet with ties to an LRT station, and they were about to ruin it.
The challenge with the Co-op Brentwood proposal wasn't simply the height of the tower. The fact it put the ass end of a grocery store where the ARP's high street was supposed to continue west didn't help, nor did the fact it maintained a substantial amount of surface parking, ensuring driving to the local retail was made as easy as possible. The residents of Brentwood had legitimate concerns with the design as it was proposed, beyond just the height that exceeded the ARP limits.
 
What happened to the video of the ASI proposal on 17th?
Next page back. ;) It got moved into the proposal urban development thread.

We had a vote a little while ago and decided to make the urban development/proposal thread the catch all thread, and construction, only stuff currently under construction that didn't have a thread.
 
The problem is the ARPs are never fully implemented, many of them have been made to seem like the city gives 2 cents. Live wire Calgary had a few councillors come on a podcast discussing some of these points. They were humble about admitting the guilt of not doing enough to implement their policies and plans. Part of the blame was shifted towards administration for not being consistent and aggressive enough in implementing the councillors visions/policies. I mean that would make a lot of sense. They also discussed about merging the development plans with transit plans to make 1 big final city plan. Hopefully a solid indefinite plan will fix this problem. As far as Brentwood goes, it honestly looks like a case of NIMBYism to me, a few loud folks complaining about less daylight on the park. From what I got in the ARP was that 90m was the tallest height recommended but seeing thats roughly 27 storeys, I don't see how 30 storeys would be the end of the world. Maybe Co-op can slash some of the height on the bigger tower and add it to the smaller ones. Still pretty pathetic IMO, most TODs around North America are opening up to taller skyscrapers on underused parking lots. Then you have that useless councillor Sean Chu telling reporters that the area may already have too much densification. I swear, he's just on council to vote NO.

View attachment 175457

I agree, 27 vs 30 is really no big deal. What I do find annoying is where a developer proposes 30 where the ARP recommends say 8, but this obviously isn't that situation.
 
Wow not sure what kind of wizardry they pulled but funding for four capital projects approved by council:

  • Arena
  • BMO Centre
  • Arts Commons (Phase 1)
  • Field house
Especially strange given that the City just wrapped up their budget process in late 2018. I guess some projects don't need the kind of transparency to be included in the same list as the rest. How they are being funded - both what public money and what private money - is also totally unknown (matching funds, private contribution, Flames share etc.) Smells suspiciously like a Olympic-bid (sans Olympics).

Put another way: what exactly is being funded? There are soo many questions outstanding on a casual allocation of $1.5 billion of public money.
  • Arena is a sketch at CMLC so far, with few public details besides the location available (we don't know the size, orientation or whether a $700 million or $500 million version was considered. No details.
  • BMO Centre has some renderings and some details released. At least it's been quasi-publicly worked on for a while
  • Art Commons (Phase 1): high level plan has been in place for a while, but no public discussion / alternatives seems to have been considered (e.g. break-up Arts Commons in several arts hubs etc.)
  • Field House: worked on indefinitely with multiple "detail-lite" concepts over the years. As far as I can tell they haven't even publicly confirmed a location, let alone a size.
I get the idea why politicians do this: regular process is slow, these are big/complex things, they want to see results, want to have ribbon cuttings. All these projects are needed (IMO) and what little is publicly known so far is promising on some of these. But ignoring the regular process is how you get highly variable outcomes, including terrible ones, because no one is accountable and the public interest isn't explicitly explored out in open. It's this kind of approach that can produce decisions to widen highways through inner city neighbourhoods or allow contractors/developers/sports teams to run-roughshod over existing plans and budgets.

Not that this needs to be doom and gloom. It is exciting to see such movement on these big ideas. Big ideas need bold approaches for sure. But public processes and transparency in decision-making exists for a reason. I hope we will not be too surprised if one (or more than one) of these projects under-performs. Imagine if the Green Line was planned this way with no public input.... we could have saved some money on consulting and open houses, but we wouldn't have ended up with a downtown tunnel.
 
Especially strange given that the City just wrapped up their budget process in late 2018. I guess some projects don't need the kind of transparency to be included in the same list as the rest. How they are being funded - both what public money and what private money - is also totally unknown (matching funds, private contribution, Flames share etc.) Smells suspiciously like a Olympic-bid (sans Olympics).

Put another way: what exactly is being funded? There are soo many questions outstanding on a casual allocation of $1.5 billion of public money.
  • Arena is a sketch at CMLC so far, with few public details besides the location available (we don't know the size, orientation or whether a $700 million or $500 million version was considered. No details.
  • BMO Centre has some renderings and some details released. At least it's been quasi-publicly worked on for a while
  • Art Commons (Phase 1): high level plan has been in place for a while, but no public discussion / alternatives seems to have been considered (e.g. break-up Arts Commons in several arts hubs etc.)
  • Field House: worked on indefinitely with multiple "detail-lite" concepts over the years. As far as I can tell they haven't even publicly confirmed a location, let alone a size.
I get the idea why politicians do this: regular process is slow, these are big/complex things, they want to see results, want to have ribbon cuttings. All these projects are needed (IMO) and what little is publicly known so far is promising on some of these. But ignoring the regular process is how you get highly variable outcomes, including terrible ones, because no one is accountable and the public interest isn't explicitly explored out in open. It's this kind of approach that can produce decisions to widen highways through inner city neighbourhoods or allow contractors/developers/sports teams to run-roughshod over existing plans and budgets.

Not that this needs to be doom and gloom. It is exciting to see such movement on these big ideas. Big ideas need bold approaches for sure. But public processes and transparency in decision-making exists for a reason. I hope we will not be too surprised if one (or more than one) of these projects under-performs. Imagine if the Green Line was planned this way with no public input.... we could have saved some money on consulting and open houses, but we wouldn't have ended up with a downtown tunnel.

The fact they keep mentioning negotiations on funding indicates to me that they are planning on using some form of Public/Private Partnership or sale/leaseback to get everything funded
 
The entrance to the lot has been blocked with concrete barriers. Doubt they would do that just to clear the snow

I found this online but not sure if it is approved or even submitted. Looks like a cool project tho.


175527
 
Huh, so it's not the WAM project on 9th that was circulating a few years ago? Did the lot used to be an Impark lot?
 

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