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Urban Development and Proposals Discussion

“We already have a commitment of $20 billion (for the Calgary-Edmonton line) . . . the challenge right now is to secure the capital for the (Edmonton) infrastructure project,” I beg your pardon?? A fantasy article for sure. Only a paltry 29 billion for what amounts to an elevated high speed rail connection between two cities of 1.5 million each.
 
Mountain Man said:
Also need to factor in that Hyperloop is never going to happen, especially in our climate! Just build the HSR and leave it.
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We have an obsession in this province for transportation hucksters and charlatans rather than boring things that work.

HSR is great, normal rail is also great. Every feasibility study since the 1980s has said yes it's a reasonably good idea and you should build it in about 5 to 10 years once the population grows. It's been 40 years of that answer, we keep exceeding our growth projections, and we now care about things like climate impacts and carbon emissions that only weight a train business case more and more positively.

Instead of progressing towards rail supported by many studies, we get a puff-piece from a new-and-shiny tech snake oil salesman every 6 to 12 months and no progress on anything. Meanwhile, billions of incremental highway expansion with little to none of the same public awareness and scrutiny, transparency or publicly available business cases just happens

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
1875 said:
I dont get how 1.3mm one way trips could pay for a $29bn project

calgaryherald.com

Developer says $22.4-billion hyperloop has economic value for Alberta

It would cost about $22.4 billion to build and launch, but a 1,000-km/h first-of-its-kind tube transport system linking Edmonton and Calgary would make economic sen…
calgaryherald.com calgaryherald.com
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Hyperloops are so dumb. If they're going to build something, just build a train between the Calgary/Edmonton cores with a stop in Red Deer. Bonus points if the line extends from Calgary to Banff.

The problem is who knows if ridership would be enough to cover the capital cost of a 300km rail line. We can't even get half of the Green Line built.
 
1875 said:
I dont get how 1.3mm one way trips could pay for a $29bn project

calgaryherald.com

Developer says $22.4-billion hyperloop has economic value for Alberta

It would cost about $22.4 billion to build and launch, but a 1,000-km/h first-of-its-kind tube transport system linking Edmonton and Calgary would make economic sen…
calgaryherald.com calgaryherald.com
Click to expand...
Six million to nine million passengers a year at $90, and 150,000 tonnes of cargo at (back of napkin to justify 60% revenue share) $6750 a tonne.

Over 30 years, that gives me at a 5% discount rate, 7.5 million passengers, a net present value of -$3 billion. At 9 million passengers a positive NPV of $2.1 billion.

Not considering any operating or maintenance costs. For private investments you need a higher rate, probably in the 8-12% range. Then cut off 20% of revenue for operating and maintenance. At 10% rate, 9 million passengers, the NPV is just shy of negative $14 billion. With $29 billion invested to get to opening day.
 
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MissingMiddle said:
Hyperloops are so dumb. If they're going to build something, just build a train between the Calgary/Edmonton cores with a stop in Red Deer. Bonus points if the line extends from Calgary to Banff.

The problem is who knows if ridership would be enough to cover the capital cost of a 300km rail line. We can't even get half of the Green Line built.
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High speed rail could be a freestanding project (the government puts in near $0). Key is corridor assembly.
 
“I've sold hyperloops to Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook, and by gum, it put them on the map!"
1604490175803-lylelanley2.jpeg
 
darwink said:
Six million to nine million passengers a year at $90, and 150,000 tonnes of cargo at (back of napkin to justify 60% revenue share) $6750 a tonne.

Over 30 years, that gives me at a 5% discount rate, 7.5 million passengers, a net present value of -$3 billion. At 9 million passengers a positive NPV of $2.1 billion.

Not considering any operating or maintenance costs. For private investments you need a higher rate, probably in the 8-12% range. Then cut off 20% of revenue for operating and maintenance. At 10% rate, 9 million passengers, the NPV is just shy of negative $14 billion. With $29 billion invested to get to opening day.
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Is 20% a reasonable assumption for operating a Hyperloop (bit rhetorical, but if someone knows, it would be great to hear). I am basing this question on my anecdotal experience with the maglev in Shanghai. I purposely travelled to the other side of the city to ride it. It went pretty fast, but not the blazing speed it was advertised at. When I asked why, I was told the power draw to hit top speed is so much, that it would actually cause brownouts in parts of Shanghai during normal times. They only on occasion, on Sunday evenings when base draw is much lower, open it up to full speed. This was all back in 2014, so not sure if it still holds water or not.

I can only imagine the power necessary to propel passenger modules at the rates of speed being advertised. I know the vacuum tube is supposed to make this minimal, but I have my doubts about the ability to build an above ground, perfectly sealed vacuum for 300 kms.
 
MichaelS said:
Is 20% a reasonable assumption for operating a Hyperloop (bit rhetorical, but if someone knows, it would be great to hear). I am basing this question on my anecdotal experience with the maglev in Shanghai. I purposely travelled to the other side of the city to ride it. It went pretty fast, but not the blazing speed it was advertised at. When I asked why, I was told the power draw to hit top speed is so much, that it would actually cause brownouts in parts of Shanghai during normal times. They only on occasion, on Sunday evenings when base draw is much lower, open it up to full speed. This was all back in 2014, so not sure if it still holds water or not.

I can only imagine the power necessary to propel passenger modules at the rates of speed being advertised. I know the vacuum tube is supposed to make this minimal, but I have my doubts about the ability to build an above ground, perfectly sealed vacuum for 300 kms.
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Today it is still a development project for sure. It is in the development hell -- once someone builds a 20 km track and shows it works, and how much it costs to meet the engineering tolerances, then it could proliferate pretty fast.

The speed is rather compelling.
 
Hi! I am wondering what's happening at a small lot in cougar ridge, there are heavy equipment on site, they already moved earth but nothing on the Calgary development map! And Colliers property management banner is on the fence, they usually manage commercial properties...
Screenshot_20210627-090508_Maps.jpg
 
Morshed said:
Hi! I am wondering what's happening at a small lot in cougar ridge, there are heavy equipment on site, they already moved earth but nothing on the Calgary development map! And Colliers property management banner is on the fence, they usually manage commercial properties...
View attachment 330697
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There's a development permit for storage space as part of the school next door.
 
Drove by the empty lot on 16ave NE & Edmonton Tr in the SE corner where the gas station used to be. Looks like something is finally going on there. All fenced off and lot leveled and clear of anything
Anyone know what is going in there?
 
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