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Urban Development and Proposals Discussion

CalgaryTiger said:
Then what's with all the talk of hundred year-old infrastructure?
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some old pipes.
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The City should be looking at fixing this infrastructure to align with the future LRT tunnel. I bet they are just replacing the pipes in their current location and will have to come back in the future and move them when we decide to build the subway.
 
Mountain Man said:
The City should be looking at fixing this infrastructure to align with the future LRT tunnel. I bet they are just replacing the pipes in their current location and will have to come back in the future and move them when we decide to build the subway.
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You really think that will get built? The wish list of the city expanding and building new lines will cost billions of dollars. I’d bet low on that most is the billions to build 8ave subway. Especially after the UCP nixed the underground portion of the greenline through downtown.
 
Mountain Man said:
Eventually it will. The issue with the green line tunnel was going under the river provided for some really unstable geology. Going under stephen Ave would be much easier and we already have 300m of tunnel there to connect to.
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The tunnel under the river was scrapped years ago. Obviously right or wrong the UCP determined the cost of tunneling through the beltline and downtown to Eau Claire was so high that elevated option was better. The geology probably isn’t much better. I doubt any future provincial government (unless Nenshi led) will put billions into an underground subway
 
Also noticed the Phil's at Glenmore and Elbow in the SW had its Land Use Approved. 26 storey's is great height for the area. And this was approved with little to no fanfare, across Glenmore from May-Fair and Belaire.

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LOC2024-0167​

Description
The application proposes to change the land-use designation of this property to allow for:
  • a mixed-use development comprising of commercial/retail on the ground floor and residential dwelling units above;
  • a maximum building height of 95 metres, about 26 storeys (an increase from the current maximum of 10 to 18 metres); and
  • a maximum building floor area of approximately 46,939 square metres.
 
The 8th Ave Subway idea, is that primarily to just move 1 line underground to increase throughput? And we'll have both 7th Ave and 8th Ave with transit? This is obviously unlikely to happen but I wonder if it's possible to change the alignment so one of the lines go through the beltline? With the level of population growth there, it's kind of crazy we have no plans for transit there.
 
Going under 8th is the plan as 7th is pretty much at capacity. Also, having trains run at street level is stupid. Sitting on a train waiting for a red light just doesn't make sense.

The tunnel under Stephen Ave exists under City Hall, a couple towers on 8th have an area for a future station. Might as well take advantage of what is already built.
 
trtcttc said:
The 8th Ave Subway idea, is that primarily to just move 1 line underground to increase throughput? And we'll have both 7th Ave and 8th Ave with transit? This is obviously unlikely to happen but I wonder if it's possible to change the alignment so one of the lines go through the beltline? With the level of population growth there, it's kind of crazy we have no plans for transit there.
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Mountain Man said:
Going under 8th is the plan as 7th is pretty much at capacity. Also, having trains run at street level is stupid. Sitting on a train waiting for a red light just doesn't make sense.

The tunnel under Stephen Ave exists under City Hall, a couple towers on 8th have an area for a future station. Might as well take advantage of what is already built.
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Someone once posted a great analysis on the capacity of 7th Avenue. I don't recall which thread but would be great to refer back to if it still exists. 7th Ave is actually pretty incredible for capacity given it's all at-grade, we often overlook how unique it is to function as good as it does. To even achieve the current state, it takes transit priority and signal adjustments all through downtown to give 7th Avenue the throughput it does. If we ever get back to reliable 4 car trains, there's still some capacity room to grow here, although I think frequency we are pretty close to the cap.

That said - it has a physical upper limit for capacity, and at-grade + interlining results in higher risks of network wide disruptions. At least a few times a year both lines go out of service for multiple hours because of a single issue on 7th Avenue. If you separate the Red (Stephen Ave) and Blue (7th Avenue) you create huge capacity for both, while reducing the network failures that the current setup has from interlining.

Instead of building the subway, the other option is to leave a pretty good 7th Avenue alone and just build more lines - Green Line for example.

This, of course, also cost billions of dollars and it's not easy either as Green Line. Once transit stabilizes it's primary network bus service finally after a decade of trying to get that going, perhaps the next update to the plans will be a greater look into more heavy/high capacity upgrades.
 
trtcttc said:
The 8th Ave Subway idea, is that primarily to just move 1 line underground to increase throughput? And we'll have both 7th Ave and 8th Ave with transit? This is obviously unlikely to happen but I wonder if it's possible to change the alignment so one of the lines go through the beltline? With the level of population growth there, it's kind of crazy we have no plans for transit there.
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Yes. The original plan was that there would be enough capacity for both lines, which would allow 7th to then be built as a twin subway eventually. I don't think that would work nearly as easily anymore. due to subsequent building.
 
CalgaryTiger said:
Every time I see a development with a more than four story underground parking I can't believe we can't do a simple cut and cover. Is it not the same damn thing?
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It's not quite the same thing because you have utilities crossing everywhere and connecting to each building along the roadway. A development generally has a contained empty lot you can drive shoring around the entire perimeter..
 
darwink said:
Yes. The original plan was that there would be enough capacity for both lines, which would allow 7th to then be built as a twin subway eventually. I don't think that would work nearly as easily anymore. due to subsequent building.
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I think if the Stephen Avenue subway is ever built, the capacity freed up for the Blue Line will mean it's would struggle to ever make the business case to build another subway there in all but the longest-term future scenario.

One thing to watch (not that closely, but in the next 50 years) is the evolution of the regional rail discussion. It's still a cocktail napkin sketch of a plan, but if it is realized at sufficient capacity and quality, it would in-turn refocus the needs of the LRT in other ways, perhaps shuffling current priorities and projects.

I still dream of a day for a Skytrain-quality SW Red-to-Red line with stops only at the major stuff along the way - Chinook, Rockyview, MRU, Marda Loop, Blue Line Transfer, Foothills, Childrens/Market Mall/University District, Red Line.

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