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Racism and Zoning discussion

darwink

darwink

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It is zoned S-CS which allows parks. Parks are typically S-R and S-PR though. The S-CS that was next to my childhood home had an underground watertank under it.

And no, zoning isn't there to provide an extra special restriction on development. Just the regular amount of racist and class-ist restrictions it has for the past century.
 
darwink said:
It is zoned S-CS which allows parks. Parks are typically S-R and S-PR though. The S-CS that was next to my childhood home had an underground watertank under it.

And no, zoning isn't there to provide an extra special restriction on development. Just the regular amount of racist and class-ist restrictions it has for the past century.
Click to expand...

Park space is public space. How is that racist or class-ist? A gated condo building replacing public space would be something to consider class-ist.

As for this situation, i didn't know the details. I was going after the article. It looks like the space iwas reserved to expand the boulevard. That is not being argued by the NIMByism

As for this masterplan, it's ordinary except for it's very tall heights. Height has everybody, both pro and against, in a tizzy and doesn't leave much room for discussion to make this less ordinary and more attractive. Taller is not better if these apartments turn out anything like their apartment blocks in Toronto.
 
maestro said:
Park space is public space. How is that racist or class-ist? A gated condo building replacing public space would be something to consider class-ist.
Click to expand...
For over 40 years, maybe 50 years, neighbours have opposed building housing on this site, keep people away from their acreages, and to preference their convenience of driving over having more places to live.

As for racism, zoning in general was created to use state power to enforce racism, I couldn't find any documentation about the approval of the JCC (text searches are hit and miss), but after it was built there are certainly some interesting examples, so I am sure it was an issue along the way:
1698001417166.png
 
badc0ffee said:
This isn't Reddit. Please stop with this nonsense.
Click to expand...
www.whitehouse.gov

Exclusionary Zoning: Its Effect on Racial Discrimination in the Housing Market | CEA | The White House

By Chair Cecilia Rouse, Jared Bernstein, Helen Knudsen, and Jeffery Zhang This Saturday, the nation recognizes Juneteenth, which marks the day a Major General of the Union Army arrived in Galveston, Texas to enforce the Emancipation Proclamation, and free the last enslaved Black people in Texas...
www.whitehouse.gov www.whitehouse.gov

nextcity.org

Apartheid by Another Name: How Zoning Regulations Perpetuate Segregation

Communities often weaponize zoning to keep the poor out of neighborhoods and suburbs with the best access to jobs or highest quality schools.
nextcity.org

www.theglobeandmail.com

Yes, remnants of discriminatory urban planning remain

From zoning bylaws to public housing, city policies can exacerbate racism. But advocates across the country are working for change
www.theglobeandmail.com www.theglobeandmail.com

But sure, it's because the grass near the intersection is "parkland".
 
Those links say that zoning can enforce racial segregation, not that that was the point of zoning in the first place.

You must live in a perpetual state of frustration if you see the world through this US social media informed lens. It's not helping you understand anything, especially in this case - people more than likely have far more mundane NIMBY concerns in mind like parking, shadows, traffic, and simple resistance to change in some place they see every day. Personally I support the project, and I can't see it doing anything for racial diversity in the area one way or the other.
 
badc0ffee said:
Those links say that zoning can enforce racial segregation, not that that was the point of zoning in the first place.

You must live in a perpetual state of frustration if you see the world through this US social media informed lens. It's not helping you understand anything, especially in this case - people more than likely have far more mundane NIMBY concerns in mind like parking, shadows, traffic, and simple resistance to change in some place they see every day. Personally I support the project, and I can't see it doing anything for racial diversity in the area one way or the other.
Click to expand...
Zoning was created to keep Chinese in certain parts of Berkeley California and to keep Jews out of certain parts of New York near simultaneously in the 1910s iirc.

May I suggest:
Arbitrary Lines: How Zoning Broke the American City and How to Fix It
https://a.co/d/4FB3942
 
darwink said:
For over 40 years, maybe 50 years, neighbours have opposed building housing on this site, keep people away from their acreages, and to preference their convenience of driving over having more places to live.

As for racism, zoning in general was created to use state power to enforce racism, I couldn't find any documentation about the approval of the JCC (text searches are hit and miss), but after it was built there are certainly some interesting examples, so I am sure it was an issue along the way:
View attachment 514835
Click to expand...
The JCC has been there since at least the mid 70s. I went to several birthday parties there during elementary school. The area around it developed very slowly as it was mostly small farms and acreages.
 
darwink said:
Zoning was created to keep Chinese in certain parts of Berkeley California and to keep Jews out of certain parts of New York near simultaneously in the 1910s iirc.

May I suggest:
Arbitrary Lines: How Zoning Broke the American City and How to Fix It
https://a.co/d/4FB3942
Click to expand...
Can we please stop importing stupidity from US identity politics and academia into Canada? Pretty please?
 
I don’t doubt that racism was a motive for zoning in past times, but I doubt it’s playing much of a part in the Glenmore Landing proposal, if any part at all.
Most is coming from the usual gripes of traffic, shadowing, parking, noise, or just plain opposition to change.
I’m guessing some opposition could also be related to classism, but if the proposal was exactly the same and the development’s units started at $1M, you’d still have the opposition.
 
JWhite said:
I’m guessing some opposition could also be related to classism, but if the proposal was exactly the same and the development’s units started at $1M, you’d still have the opposition.
Click to expand...
For sure some of it is related to classism. Every corner of the world has classism and it’s been around since the dawn of time. There will always be efforts to get away from it, but it will never go away completely, it’s not the way humans are built.
This’ll ruffle some feathers I’m sure, but I don’t care. I don’t generally have an issue with classism. Racism, yes, but classism no. If you’re well to do and have the means to live in a more expensive but desirable neighborhood, so be it. That’s the way it is in a free market economy and it isn’t any different in the communist system.
That’s the way it is everywhere, and you can’t artificially change that, although you can bend a bit and be somewhat reasonable. With this proposal I wouldn’t be opposed to it if I lived in the neighborhood. I would oppose a drop in centre being built there, but not this.
 
Atticus said:
That’s the way it is everywhere, and you can’t artificially change that, although you can bend a bit and be somewhat reasonable. With this proposal I wouldn’t be opposed to it if I lived in the neighborhood. I would oppose a drop in centre being built there, but not this.
Click to expand...
This is where I stand. I don’t fundamentally have an issue with rich people living in more exclusive neighbourhoods, but as you put it, people have to bend and be reasonable.
I can guarantee you nobody here on this forum would want a drop in centre built in their neighborhood, and many wouldn’t want low-cost housing projects for example, in their rich neighborhood, and I get it.
Adding general density is where people have to be reasonable.
 
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