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Calgary & Alberta Economy

DougB said:
All that is need are new pipelines to the west and gulf coasts, twinning the TCH through BC and freeway access to all port facilities in Vancouver area. BC will struggle to meet internal power demand so talk of more power lines isn't relevant. Laurentian Canada already has great export infrastructure
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The goal is to be less dependent on the USA to reduce a huge strategic vulnerability. That means economics (and therefor delivery to the gulf coast) is no longer the first concern).
 
Chowda7 said:
ca.news.yahoo.com

Calgary mayor calls for federal help in fast-tracking Prairie Economic Gateway project

Calgary's mayor wants Prime Minister Mark Carney to designate proposed Prairie Economic Gateway as a project of national interest in order to get the industrial hub built faster. Jyoti Gondek says the project meets the qualifications for the designation, which was introduced as part of the...
ca.news.yahoo.com ca.news.yahoo.com
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No where in the article does it mention what federal process is holding it up if any. Not only that, but entering into a new uncertain process instead of a known one is adding more risk (and likely time) not removing any. Pure grandstanding.
 
DougB said:
Really? This is a local facility that doesn't cross provincial boundaries and is mostly warehouses
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Most railways fall under the federal railway power, and this project doesn't just incidentally connect to the mainline, the entire purpose is serving the mainline. So the principle that elevated NGTL to federal regulation applies here. (NGTL wanted to be federally regulated).

There will be an initial hearing and I bet it would have been punted to provincial only due to likely low impact, but now that the Mayor says it is a project of national significance, if anyone wants to keep it federal, it will stay federal.
 
Surrealplaces said:
calgaryherald.com

Varcoe: The game 'is just getting started' — the pursuit of Alberta's $100B data centre dream revs up

The Alberta Data Centre race is now squarely underway, with several energy players making strategic moves to develop the industry.
calgaryherald.com calgaryherald.com
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What's the economic case for these projects? Very little employment outside of construction, the consumption curve is really challenging for utilities, and regular citizens are the ones dealing with the externalities - additional emissions, destruction of natural resources. Oil and gas drives significant ongoing revenues and has a very large employment base, to justify the negative externalities. I just don't see it with data centres.
 
trtcttc said:
I just don't see it with data centres.
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A data centre consuming natural gas power generation through a new build power purchase agreement is consumption of natural gas. Little difference to building a pipeline for export, except the 'export' is within Alberta. Natural gas consumption within Alberta that doesn't compete for takeaway capacity is a huge net positive. Think of it as akin to being able to build an LNG plant within the province, where the value add is the 'data centre spread' whereas the LNG project value add is the freeze spread. Employment isn't the only benefit to look at, as LNG has relatively little long term employment too, but we still want to do that.

Even more, think about a South Korean data company. Either they can import LNG to run a data centre in Korea, or they can import the data centre services, and save a lot of money compared to their base case, while Alberta makes more money.
 
It also mentions carbon capture as part of the project. How much and how effective I can't say, but having carbon capture involved mitigates the emissions issue.
 
darwink said:
A data centre consuming natural gas power generation through a new build power purchase agreement is consumption of natural gas. Little difference to building a pipeline for export, except the 'export' is within Alberta. Natural gas consumption within Alberta that doesn't compete for takeaway capacity is a huge net positive. Think of it as akin to being able to build an LNG plant within the province, where the value add is the 'data centre spread' whereas the LNG project value add is the freeze spread. Employment isn't the only benefit to look at, as LNG has relatively little long term employment too, but we still want to do that.

Even more, think about a South Korean data company. Either they can import LNG to run a data centre in Korea, or they can import the data centre services, and save a lot of money compared to their base case, while Alberta makes more money.
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Thanks for that explanation. The business really isn't the data centre, but the utilizing of our gas resources. I do hope we spend some time scrutinizing the impact on residents. There's some power quality issues that's beginning to emerge with AI data centres, and hopefully it doesn't turn into the orphaned wells issue of the past where the taxpayer ends up being on the hook for damages done by corporations.
 
darwink said:
A data centre consuming natural gas power generation through a new build power purchase agreement is consumption of natural gas. Little difference to building a pipeline for export, except the 'export' is within Alberta. Natural gas consumption within Alberta that doesn't compete for takeaway capacity is a huge net positive. Think of it as akin to being able to build an LNG plant within the province, where the value add is the 'data centre spread' whereas the LNG project value add is the freeze spread. Employment isn't the only benefit to look at, as LNG has relatively little long term employment too, but we still want to do that.

Even more, think about a South Korean data company. Either they can import LNG to run a data centre in Korea, or they can import the data centre services, and save a lot of money compared to their base case, while Alberta makes more money.
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I largely agree. The issues are:

-can these data centers draw from the grid if their behind the fence generation goes down? If they can, AESO pricing will rise
-can these data centers curtail usage and export to the grid during periods of expected high price or coincident peaks? This would benefit consumers but could harm generators and force them to offer higher into the energy and operating reserve markets
-the additional gas consumption will drive up market prices for gas and hence electricity which will affect consumers. As you pointed out, the impact would be no different than exporting that gas
 
darwink said:
Most railways fall under the federal railway power, and this project doesn't just incidentally connect to the mainline, the entire purpose is serving the mainline. So the principle that elevated NGTL to federal regulation applies here. (NGTL wanted to be federally regulated).

There will be an initial hearing and I bet it would have been punted to provincial only due to likely low impact, but now that the Mayor says it is a project of national significance, if anyone wants to keep it federal, it will stay federal.
Click to expand...
So what is the test? Is it any project that proposes a rail spur or is it any project that could increase mainline traffic? Seems ridiculous to mandate anything beyond local approvals
 
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