Green Line LRT | ?m | ?s | Calgary Transit

Go Elevated or try for Underground?

  • Work with the province and go with the Elevated option

    Votes: 50 79.4%

  • Try another approach and go for Underground option

    Votes: 9 14.3%

  • Cancel it altogether

    Votes: 1 1.6%

  • Go with a BRT solution

    Votes: 3 4.8%
  • Total voters
    63
Probably some unprecedented vote combinations on these motions. Unfortunately the most progressive councillors are coming out guns blazing here with a lot of ironic hyperbole:

https://livewirecalgary.com/2025/01...ies-all-the-risk-on-new-green-line-alignment/

Mayor Jyoti Gondek was equally forceful in her opposition to the project. She said after a call from the province last Friday at 9:15 p.m. she realized the province was not interested in being a partner on the Green Line.

“Rather, they’re interested in exercising power and control, demanding that their whimsical vision of an elevated train hammering through downtown is the only option.”

The mayor said that Calgary taxpayers will take on all the additional risk, and couldn’t stand behind a decision that could destroy the downtown.

“Their proposed alignment will rattle past buildings. It will be careening above our Plus-15 network, and it will create a condition that will make corporations second guess their decision to headquarter in our city, never mind the safety issues that will be created by this alignment with massive pillars that reduce eyes on the street, take away traffic lanes and encourage the type of criminal activity that we have tried so hard to remove from our downtown,” she said.
Click to expand...
 
I honestly think this is the best decision City Council could make at this point. Secure the Provincial & Federal funding and get working on the line from Shepard to Scotia Place while the Beltline & Downtown portion is finalized.
Who knows, when it comes time to build the central portion Nenshi could be Premier and the Province will buck-up for the original tunnelled plan.
It will be (hopefully 🤞🏼) exciting to finally see actual construction work under way in the spring of 2025.
 
It'll be interesting to see if the Province approves this with the timelines and rough schedule the city has laid out.
It would seem fairly transparent that getting shovels in the ground this year is to essentially tie every level of government into their commitment with minimal avenues of pulling out. Then the DT detailed planning/consultation can be dragged out a little, possibly to the next provincial election to secure additional funding for either underground or through to Eau Claire and possibly over the river.

The city basically had no choice on agreeing with the province's alignment but how they've staged it out, still leaves them a few possibilities.

I do wonder though, will this push the province to start a central station and regional rail, sooner rather than later?
It wouldn't make sense to build a standalone station, then in a couple of years tear it down to build a new Central. Unless it could be built somewhat modular so that the Regional and HSR portion could be added later
 
lemongrab said:
Probably some unprecedented vote combinations on these motions. Unfortunately the most progressive councillors are coming out guns blazing here with a lot of ironic hyperbole:

https://livewirecalgary.com/2025/01...ies-all-the-risk-on-new-green-line-alignment/
Click to expand...
I agree with starting something, especially since it starts from the South and realistically won't get to downtown for another few years. The part I do not agree with is the city taking on the cost overruns, when we have the least fiscal capacity to do so. The ideal outcome is that funding the downtown portion lines up with the provincial election and we get an injection of cash like with the Event Centre.

While I agree there's issues with the process, some of the councillors that were willing to die on the hill for "respect" is just grandstanding. The reality is the city is a creature of the province, if you want the power, run to be an MLA. And some of the opinions of elevated rail is a bit dramatic, especially around crime and disorder, those exist with underground stations too if not more so since it is warm and out of sight.
 
I think it's a safe bet the UCP gives this the thumbs up and the Feds rubber stamp whatever business case is sent to them.

The ultimate irony of course is that splitting the construction at 4th St into two procurement contracts was the plan back in 2019 and the UCP blocked it with their review and insistence that procurement be done in 1 large contract. Now we're back to doing the same thing Council wanted to do in 2019 but with the SE leg opening in 2031 instead of 2026.

1000029108.jpg
 
Safe to say we're getting something. We have a pretty good idea what's going to be west of the Elbow River but what will be west of the Elbow River is not wide open like some think it is. The City is going to study the recommended alignment, if they want to go back to underground that would be thrown away. I don't think there's still a door open to underground or any other route. Elevated is what it is going to be. I'd like more details on the next steps, I have no many questions...

From the CityTV piece

City administration ultimately recommended a north-south elevated track along 2 Street SW through downtown and will now conduct a full study on the proposed elevated alignment.

Other parts of the approved recommendations from the city include the Green Line connecting with the existing CTrain Red and Blue Lines, the new event centre at a proposed Grand Central Station and allowing for a future connection between the north and south legs of the line.

Genera Manager Michael Thompson says part of the approved recommendations would see work begin on the southeast portion of the line this year and construction on the downtown segment starting in 2027.

So, they'll take the 5% PDF, and turn it into an actual option. That will need to happen pretty quick if they want construction to start in less than three years. The detailed airport rail study should be out any day (we already know the high-level plan), and there's the larger rail plan out by the summer so it won't be long before we know timelines for Grand Central. In that five months, I assume the City will work with the Province to integrate their work on the 4th Street Station into the Grand Central.

There are many unknowns, like how to get to from Grand Central to 2 Street SW. I have not seen that spelled out. The City's study will need to spend a lot of time on that. Whatever happens there likely determines if the line goes to Eau Claire or stops at 7 Ave.
 
goodcitywhenfinished said:
Rail bed dampening technology has improved a lot since the 70s and 80s when those tracks went in.

This line will be very quiet if specced properly.
Click to expand...
The worst of council was shown yesterday. Grandstanding, Hyperbole, Fearmongering, etc. Some leadership yesterday would've been nice. You're right, there are good ways to do elevated, we cannot pretend we're the first city to build elevated rail downtown. A true leader yesterday would've accepted the circumstance and said, how can we make this the best it can be? We've all, on this forum, imagined how great it can be (+15 integration, ways to activate the street level, a cool central station at 7th Ave), would be nice to see that from our council.
 
outoftheice said:
The ultimate irony of course is that splitting the construction at 4th St into two procurement contracts was the plan back in 2019 and the UCP blocked it with their review and insistence that procurement be done in 1 large contract.
Click to expand...
The split contract was a problem due to the risk structure of the tunnel. No tunnel, to problem with a split contract.
 
trtcttc said:
The part I do not agree with is the city taking on the cost overruns, when we have the least fiscal capacity to do so.
Click to expand...
It was ever thus. And the fiscal capacity argument is wrong. Calgary's fiscal capacity is set solely by Councillors. Calgary also has a boat load of money in reserves, in theory to pay for things like cost overruns.
 
CalgaryTiger said:
There are many unknowns, like how to get to from Grand Central to 2 Street SW. I have not seen that spelled out. The City's study will need to spend a lot of time on that. Whatever happens there likely determines if the line goes to Eau Claire or stops at 7 Ave.
Click to expand...
? Down the middle of tenth? Not too big of a shift from the north sidewalk of tenth. Hardly worth mentioning imo.
1738171695263.png
1738171834846.png

1738170582249.png
1738170451923.png
1738170212299.png
 
Last edited:
darwink said:
Down the middle of tenth
Click to expand...
That's what the 5% says. The city mentioned in the bath and forth battle having just moved all the utilities from 11th to 10th. Does going down 10th mean needing to move all those back to 11th?

The city has said they're now starting the work required to deliver a Functional Plan for the 5% concept. Step one is probably public engagement. Step two should be asking what enabling works would need to be done to make this happen? Step three then should be, how do we minimize this work and any rework?

I really wonder what the public engagement from the city will look like. They say they want broad support before advancing any additional work. City staff will come back quarterly with updates until Q4 2026 when they want approval to start construction on the downtown segment in 2027. I think that is a very tight timeline.
 
You must log in or register to post here.

Back
Top